Are the majority of Flying Frog's games, dead games?

[samuraitrev]

Hi all, I've been thinking about posting something like this for a while but I kinda didn't want to admit to myself that these games are dead. I guess this is why I spend so much time on projects and adding to the games.

With a question like the topic title, I guess I better back it up with some evidence. I'm talking about the boxed games and I'm not including things like figures made with different colours or buttons! etc. OOP=Out of Production

Game
AToE 2020 Card Pack 'Hero Upgrades'
LNoE 2018 Hero Card 'Old Betsy'
CoPE 2014 Card Pack 'The Hora'Goth'
FaNG (OOP) 2013 Card Pack 'Danger Pack 1'
IFOS 2010 Card Pack 'Advanced Abilities'

Well guys what do you think? Are these games dead? Will Flying Frog bring out anything for these games?

[Old Dwarf]

Maybe? They seem to be but again there not things that would require any retooling
so it doesn't seem like a lot of effort to simply do another print run.

If FFP can ever get out from under SoB there may be hope.

OD

[Raynor]

I'd say technically no, but personally, I've come to view them as such.

Little promos and expansions do seem to trickle out once in a great while, but they have 6 games outside of Shadows of Brimstone, and they seem to release new things for maybe one of those non-SoB games each year if you're lucky.
The possibility of one micro expansion once every 5-6 years isn't enough for me to consider a game actively supported. It's nice when these things pop up but I don't invest any energy in looking forward to it. This does make visiting the Frog's booth at a con a fun experience, as weird mini expansions for old favorite games do pop up once in a blue moon. That being said, all the regular Frog games are on my list of "complete" games like Eldritch Horror, AH2E, etc.

For A Touch of Evil and Fortune and Glory I think it's a higher chance than the rest of their games that we'll eventually see new content. Based on Q&As, though, I don't think they have any plans to extend the AToE Board. All the commentary I've heard has been about potential new Epic Villains they were thinking about.

Fortune and Glory essentially has 2 completed expansions hanging out waiting for art assets and a spot in the factory production queue, which requires them complete delivery for Brimstone Adventures. I don't think they're going to leave that one forever considering so much work has already been completed there.

The problem with SoB is they don't seem to want to get out from under it, and since that's nearly all they've put energy into for the last decade, it unsurprisingly has a bigger fan base at this point, giving them little incentive to branch out.

[Achtung Panzer]

I'm disappointed with FFP's approach to issuing Anniversry versions. There's nothing meaningful that's new to exisiting players and they come in at a very high price point. My preference would be that resources / effort were spent on mini-expansions plus base game reprints to satisfy existing and new fans.

But I see no indication of a move away from SoB. I would've thought putting 'all their eggs in one basket' is a risky business strategy.

[Raynor]

I actually like the anniversary editions for the functional all-in-one storage, if nothing else. I dislike having to juggle a ton of expansion boxes during game play, so just being able to store everything in one place was worth it for me. The frog's attention to decent storage solutions was one of the highlights of their early approach to game design for me and something I'd generally like to see in any games I pick up. Having to build out your own custom storage box or needing to buy one from an incredibly expensive after market seller like you need to do with a CMON game with expansions, or any Fantasy Flight offering is generally a frustrating if necessary endeavor for me. It's also my biggest ongoing frustration with Shadows of Brimstone. That game has plenty of issues but its biggest nemesis is setting up a functionally accessible storage method. I've been wrestling with that for years. The game would shine so much more if it were easier to get to the table.

[samuraitrev]

Thanks for posting your comments. I do like the anniversary editions and if I was just starting out that's the way I'd go. I can't justify buying them now I have everything for the games. Plus I store them in in storage organisers (the plastic cases for nuts and bolts etc like these). https://www.amazon.co.uk/DUAO-Hardware-S...64&sr=8-91

I think if we don't keep Flying Frog's games alive, no one will. Even though that should be the Frog's responsibility! They've created a lot of disappointment by having expansions being delayed for YEARS. I'm not having it either that it was because of Covid. SoB has become bloated to the point of being unmanageable and their other games have been left to die.

If the Frog believes they've gone as far as they can with their previous games perhaps they should create a new game? I agree with Panzer that a company shouldn't just focus on just one game. I'm aware Flying Frog are a business and I'm happy that they're making money and are still in business. After all we're all here on a fan site and we wish them all the best. Their production is top notch. Their rule systems are pretty good (I can only speak for LNoE, AToE and FaNG). I just sincerely believe they could do more for their previous games. I do believe they would make money. Perhaps not SoB scale money but I still think there's plenty of people out there who would throw money at them for more content for the games in my OP.

Come on Frog make 2023 an awesome year for ALL your games!

[Raynor]

Agreed. As fun as expansions are, I’d love to see them make more new games. Game design has rocketed forward in the last decade. I didn’t like the original Zombicide all that much more than LNoE but one company kept iterating and the other didn’t. Now, thanks to all the later versions, Zombicide is my preferred zombie game.

You can see the huge strides they made in design between SoB and Forbidden Fortress, but even that is a 5 years old innovation on a 9 year old system. I’d really like to see them try something completely new as a team. They have perfect aesthetic sensibilities and with all they’ve learned I’d love to see what they would choose to do now.

I still remember how incredibly excited I was when the Shadows of Brimstone project was first revealed. I think the game turned out really well. Dungeon crawling is like my 2nd favorite genre after adventure games like AToE. But I’d love to see them unleash that level of creative new energy again on something else entirely unique like they used to.