jade vs barbed wire ?

[PJ Mobile]

if jade rolls double 1's and a 6 with garden shears agianst a zombie with barbed wire. does she take a wound ? i think she losses, zombie dies ?

[munkymuddface]

From the Wiki:

http://flyingfrogwiki.com/ffpwiki/index....arbed_Wire
Q. Barbed Wire says you Instantly Lose the fight, but Meat Cleaver says it is Instantly killed... Hmm... So which is it? Lose? Killed? or... Both?

A. The intent is that all 'Instant' effects would resolve simultaniously. So in this case, the Hero would Kill the Zombie and the Hero would lose the Fight (and take a wound).

That being said, Jade does not takes the wound in this case since she rolled doubles, triggering her Rebellious (I think that's the name of it) ability, which allows her to ignore a wound if she rolls doubles*.

*Disclaimer: Don't have the cards in front of me, and I don't see Jade's abilities listed on the wiki, so I really hope I am remembering her abilities correctly...

[PJON]

Hi, this is where my problem lies. "instantly" Some cards say, "automaticly" and "immediatley". Some cards say "may not in any way"

Barbed Wire
The Zombie is tangled in barbed wire. If a Hero rolls a 1 on any of their Fight Dice while in a Fight with the Zombie, that Hero instantly loses the fight.

"It didn't even slow him down!!!"

Notes from Board Game Geek
Q. Barbed Wire says you Instantly Lose the fight, but Meat Cleaver says it is Instantly killed... Hmm... So which is it? Lose? Killed? or... Both?

A. The intent is that all 'Instant' effects would resolve simultaniously. So in this case, the Hero would Kill the Zombie and the Hero would lose the Fight (and take a wound).

The reason that the fight does not normally Resolve with a Meat Cleaver 6 is that the Zombie is Instantly Killed before moving on, so there is no Zombie left to Resolve the Fight with.

So the Barbed wire Instant is not taken into account ? Just like when the Hero Rolls the 6, a Zombie is not allowed a responce, Re-rolls or some other effect. Why would it be fair that the Hero-Jade. Is allowed to use an effect, when an Instant is played on her ?

Just like the Garden Shears or Meat Clever, its Instant. No Secondary effect allowed. Right ?

My Opinion is, both Instant attacks take effect, both take damage. Like the Example above A. The intent is that all 'Instant' effects would resolve simultaniously. Jade ability wound be voided, just like as if a Zombie player played Undead Hate the Living, before any fight dice are rolled.

This had to of happened to someone already, what did you do ?

[mqstout]

Though this goes contrary to that FAQ entry, I'd say Barbed Wire trumps Meat Cleaver in this case. Barbed Wire is inherent to the Grave Weapon zombie and is always active. Meat Cleaver is a Combat Bonus: ability that you have to activate.

I'm always reminding people they don't automatically get Combat Bonuses unless they want to use them. IE, if they somehow know the zombie player has It's Stuck in his hand...

[PJON]

Hi mqstout. LOL, yes i was a Nazi about that, for a while. If a Hero had a combat bonus, and it did not add to their intial roll. I would want them to tell me if their using it. Just incase i had "its Stuck" Cause we all know they were using it, if they needed the bonus, and were not using it if it didnt.

I like the way you think.

I wish flying frog had more FAQ's or a place to ask them. They really need a lawyer or english major working there. LOL

[PJON]

Garden Shears-Double-Handed-COMBAT BONUS:
The Hero rolls an extra Fight Dice.
If the Hero rolls a 6 on any of their Fight Dice, the Zombie is instantly Killed.
Meat Cleaver-COMBAT BONUS:
If the Hero rolls a 6 on any of their Fight Dice, the Zombie is instantly Killed.
Instantly Killed-FAQ
Q16: Meat Cleaver - How do ‘instant’ kills work with weapons such as the Meat Cleaver?
A16: With the Meat Cleaver’s Combat Bonus, if a Hero rolls a 6 on any of their Fight Dice, the Zombie they are fighting is instantly Killed and the Fight ends immediately. Because it is ‘instant’, Zombies do NOT even get the chance to play cards (may not force a re-roll etc). It is also important to note that the Fight is NOT Resolved (the Hero is not hurt, even if the Zombie would normally have won the Fight).
The roll MAY be modified in order to get a 6 (adding extra dice, Re-rolling, adding 1 to a roll to change a 5 result into a 6), but once a 6 is rolled, the Hero may instantly act on it to use the Meat Cleaver’s Combat Bonus. If a Hero decides not to use the Combat Bonus to ‘instantly’ Kill (say they do not want to Kill the Zombie for some reason), the opportunity is wasted and the Meat Cleaver may NOT be used in conjunction with that 6 roll for the rest of the Fight.


Barbed Wire
The Zombie is tangled in barbed wire. If a Hero rolls a 1 on any of their Fight Dice while in a Fight with the Zombie, that Hero instantly loses the fight.

The Fight
Fight - A single hand-to-hand combat between a Hero and a Zombie.
To fight, both players roll a number of dice for their model involved as listed below. These are called Fight Dice. When rolling Fight Dice the players use their highest dice roll to determine who wins.
· Heroes roll 2 Fight Dice
· Zombies roll 1 Fight Dice
· Zombies win on a tie.
Resolving the Fight
A Fight is only resolved after all players have decided not to use any more cards or abilities.
Once both players have chosen their highest Fight Dice roll and are done using cards and abilities, the fight is resolved as follows:
- If the Zombie wins (has a higher roll or is tied for highest), the Hero takes one Wound.
- If the Hero has a higher roll, the Zombie is Fended Off. The fight ends and both the Hero and Zombie remain in the space, unaffected.
- If the Hero has a higher roll and has rolled doubles on ANY of their Fight Dice (two 5’s for instance), the Zombie takes one Wound (removing it from the board).

So after all that info, I say both would take effect, even with Jade. The fight ends immediately. According to the FAQ on Instantly. The Fight has ended, but it also becomes resolved. The Hero has lost. The effects are Instant, both voiding a pre-set rules or effects.

I can grasp the point that; when a hero uses the meat clever.

It instantly kills the zombie – chopped it’s head off so fast – The zombie has no time to react, play cards etc….

I also grasp getting cut by barbed wire - chopped it’s head off so fast; I didn’t realize I got cut by barbed wire – Neither player has time to react. Inherent or not


There, that’s how I see it. Jade or not. The “instant” factor supersedes any previous text.

Zombies win on ties
The fight is resolved when all player are done using their cards or abilities.

The hero’s 6 supersedes zombies winning on ties, and resolving the fight
The barbed wire 1 supersedes resolving the fight with abilities or cards.

Both take effect. Instant head on floor, and some sorta blood letting


grrrrr my head hurts

---

what if johnny rolled double 1's and a zombie player rolled a 1 as well. Johnny does not win that tie. Barbed wire says he loses. same as jade, the 1 that was rolled takes effect.

[D153453D]

I'm going to go ahead and on this one.

[vikinglad]

My two scents:

Cleaver and Barbed wire are both instant. Zed is decapitated and falls on hero, causing an unavoidable loss of the fight (even though a loss that results in your opponent being decapitated while you live on can hardly be described as a loss). The normal outcome of losing a fight is a wound, but Jade can avoid this consequence. Whether the fight was lost instantly or not should not affect her rebelious ability.

If the barbed wire description said "instantly takes a wound," then the wound could not be avoided.

[PJON]

Hi Vikinglad

Resolving the Fight
A Fight is only resolved after all players have decided not to use any more cards or abilities.

If the fight has instantly ended. Heroes do not get to use cards or abilities ?

Here is another Monkey Wrench, i came across.
So, normal game play is; If you use a meat clever or garden shears and roll a 6. The Zombie is instantly dead. As in instantly, right ? No cards or abilities allowed, right ? So, since a zombie is not allowed to use any cards or abilities, when do you get to play

Feels No Pain
Fight:

Play this card to let a Zombie Re-roll any number of its Fight Dice.

or

Play to prevent a Zombie from being 'instantly' Killed.

do yah play it before the fight ? Just saying.

[vikinglad]

I have never seen this card, but the wording on this card implies that it was specifically made for situations like the cleaver. So play it after the instant kill to prevent it. Anyone else think differently?