Zombie Card idea - Gunshot attracts zombies

[Garaile]

Figured I'd offer my two cents as well.

Another (possibly for additional DOTS still?) addition to the Summoning Blast idea would be a chance that the Zombies get to spawn additional zombies on that tile's spawn point.

I'd always assumed that the daylight track ticking down (in most scenarios) represented the horde shambling closer and that the zombies the Heroes see are sort of the frontrunners. This would basically just pull additional zombies away from the Horde and bring them on a little faster.

[ForestRunner]

(01-02-2013 08:59 PM)StayPuft Wrote:  That said, thematically I think of zombies as being very animalistic. So, I could imagine them being about ready to attack somebody, then being distracted by a loud noise. I could easily see an animal doing that, even if they are a predator about to go after their prey. So, I could personally give it a pass if a zombie did it. Probably not if they were currently in the process of a fight, but with the way the turns happen, they wouldn't be anyway.

I don't know StayPuft. Animals and predators have survival instincts in the wild. They are intelligent and have keen senses, thus would be wary of noise and would even forgo a meal if threatened. Zombies don't have the intelligence to be distracted - they know nothing but flesh and brains - and this is perfectly represented in the Zombie Hunger rule.

[LSD]

(11-18-2012 02:15 AM)ForestRunner Wrote:  Trying it as a rule, believe or not, actually changes the character of LNoE quite a bit - but that's ok, if that's what you want. One thing we found not quite right, as written in my previous post, was the ability for the Zombie player to move towards another Hero. It's not a logical or thematic fit.

The bloodbath variant, was indeed - just that. Especially using it in Revenge of the Dead.



RULE: So far, we've come up with this as an optional/house rule, but granted will need more testing... can be part of the dot point system - still weighing this up as I've added something else at the end for consideration:

Zombie Sense: When a Hero makes a Ranged Attack roll 1d6 for each Zombie on that board tile, that is not subject to Zombie Hunger rules. Results as follows:
1-2: No effect.
3: Zombie moves one space in any direction (Zombie Player's Choice) - simulates the Zombie is aware of the sound/vibrational disturbance, but cannot pinpoint exact location.
4-6: Zombie moves one space toward the Hero initiating the Ranged Attack, in a manner that would represent the shortest distance travelled towards the Hero - sort of like a semi Zombie Hunger rule.

NB:
1) The Hero may make the "Ranged Attack" at an empty space, but is still subect to any ammo exhaustion or discard rules associated with use of the weapon - represents deliberate lure/bait.
2) Rule is applicable to the centre/square board.

Alternatively...

CARD: - instead of a rule, include the following cards in the Zombie Deck, at a frequency of 4 or 5 per 50 card deck. Just a guess using the Shamble card frequency in the TP deck.

Keen Senses - Zombie Event: When a Hero makes a Ranged Attack roll 1d6. All Zombies on that board tile can move one space toward the Hero initiating the Ranged Attack on a roll of 4+.


Whether Rule or Card, it does alter the use of ranged weapons a little, the Heroes are also in a position to use them more creatively as well - ie luring them towards existing fires or gas markers, or even luring them away like the Pied Gunslinger of Hamelin, or simply refrain from using them completely for select turns.

I'm loving this, what is your take on explosions?

[StayPuft]

(01-03-2013 02:34 AM)ForestRunner Wrote:  

(01-02-2013 08:59 PM)StayPuft Wrote:  That said, thematically I think of zombies as being very animalistic. So, I could imagine them being about ready to attack somebody, then being distracted by a loud noise. I could easily see an animal doing that, even if they are a predator about to go after their prey. So, I could personally give it a pass if a zombie did it. Probably not if they were currently in the process of a fight, but with the way the turns happen, they wouldn't be anyway.

I don't know StayPuft. Animals and predators have survival instincts in the wild. They are intelligent and have keen senses, thus would be wary of noise and would even forgo a meal if threatened. Zombies don't have the intelligence to be distracted - they know nothing but flesh and brains - and this is perfectly represented in the Zombie Hunger rule.

I definitely see where you are going and can agree in large part. But, again, if we are accepting that the sound of the gunshot can attract the zombie, I would think it could also distract them.

But, again, I could definitely see this going either way. And, as I said, my personal preference would be that they not get distracted and are still subject to Zombie Hunger. I am just kind of playing Devil's Advocate, so to speak, to show how it kind of could work. I don't think of it as an intelligence thing. Just the opposite, in fact. It isn't that the zombies are intelligent enough to understand that the gunshot could mean a threat. It is that they are stupid enough to be distracted by a sudden loud noise. Kind of like how a very unintelligent creature may be distracted by a shiny object. LOL!

[LSD]

(01-03-2013 09:31 PM)StayPuft Wrote:  

(01-03-2013 02:34 AM)ForestRunner Wrote:  

(01-02-2013 08:59 PM)StayPuft Wrote:  That said, thematically I think of zombies as being very animalistic. So, I could imagine them being about ready to attack somebody, then being distracted by a loud noise. I could easily see an animal doing that, even if they are a predator about to go after their prey. So, I could personally give it a pass if a zombie did it. Probably not if they were currently in the process of a fight, but with the way the turns happen, they wouldn't be anyway.

I don't know StayPuft. Animals and predators have survival instincts in the wild. They are intelligent and have keen senses, thus would be wary of noise and would even forgo a meal if threatened. Zombies don't have the intelligence to be distracted - they know nothing but flesh and brains - and this is perfectly represented in the Zombie Hunger rule.

I definitely see where you are going and can agree in large part. But, again, if we are accepting that the sound of the gunshot can attract the zombie, I would think it could also distract them.

But, again, I could definitely see this going either way. And, as I said, my personal preference would be that they not get distracted and are still subject to Zombie Hunger. I am just kind of playing Devil's Advocate, so to speak, to show how it kind of could work. I don't think of it as an intelligence thing. Just the opposite, in fact. It isn't that the zombies are intelligent enough to understand that the gunshot could mean a threat. It is that they are stupid enough to be distracted by a sudden loud noise. Kind of like how a very unintelligent creature may be distracted by a shiny object. LOL!

I don't think the rule should trump zombie hunger only allow the random zombies in the distance to be attracted to the noise as well as near by ones.

[ForestRunner]

(01-03-2013 09:31 PM)StayPuft Wrote:  I definitely see where you are going and can agree in large part. But, again, if we are accepting that the sound of the gunshot can attract the zombie, I would think it could also distract them.

A gunshot attracts a zombie not in the presence of a potential food source, becasue it may signify a possible food source. A zombie in the presence of a potential food source cannot be deterred by anything or anyone (again Zombie Hunger rule).

I believe you'll break the game if you allow it, since it defies a major fundamental of the rules, and everything thematic about zombies and their ravenous appetite.

(01-03-2013 09:31 PM)StayPuft Wrote:  But, again, I could definitely see this going either way. And, as I said, my personal preference would be that they not get distracted and are still subject to Zombie Hunger. I am just kind of playing Devil's Advocate, so to speak, to show how it kind of could work. I don't think of it as an intelligence thing. Just the opposite, in fact. It isn't that the zombies are intelligent enough to understand that the gunshot could mean a threat. It is that they are stupid enough to be distracted by a sudden loud noise. Kind of like how a very unintelligent creature may be distracted by a shiny object. LOL!

If a zombie could determnine a gunshot is a threat that would open up a can of worms. Surely they would be able to perceive a chainsaw, hedge trimmers or someone wielding a nice shiny cleaver as a threat as well?

If it's the Walking Dead theme you're striving for, remember the scenes in the CDC bunker in season 1 with the brain activity patterns - this concluded non intelligence... which is also consistent to the LNoE rules where it explicitly states zombies are in fact a mindless bunch.

[StayPuft]

(01-03-2013 10:52 PM)ForestRunner Wrote:  If a zombie could determnine a gunshot is a threat that would open up a can of worms. Surely they would be able to perceive a chainsaw, hedge trimmers or someone wielding a nice shiny cleaver as a threat as well?

If it's the Walking Dead theme you're striving for, remember the scenes in the CDC bunker in season 1 with the brain activity patterns - this concluded non intelligence... which is also consistent to the LNoE rules where it explicitly states zombies are in fact a mindless bunch.

No, I said that, in my view, they CANNOT interpret a gunshot as a potential threat. In my view, the possible way to thematically explain that is that they are so stupid that they get distracted by the loud sound. It is similar to how I personally thematically explain the Zombies with Grave Weapons you get in one of the expansions. They aren't smart enough to know that what they have is a weapon, they just mindlessly grabbed it at some point to swing around and club at somebody with, and may just happen to get lucky and actually wind up making use of it. (In other words, a monkey may not know what a knife is, but I still wouldn't recommend hanging around if the monkey picked one up.)

Again, though, I actually agree with you. Just kind of saying how you could potentially argue it the other way. Personally, I would agree with you that the zombie would NOT be distracted. If anything, if they were about to attack a human and the gunshot, or other loud noise, were RIGHT THERE where they are, they might get distracted for a second, but then they would go right back to their attempted meal. Granted, maybe that few seconds of distraction could allow the human to get free, but I personally wouldn't imagine the zombie getting distracted from their would-be meal for more than a second or two.

But, I also agree that, setting aside the thematic nature of the game itself, Zombie Hunger is one of the most important (not to mention most fun) aspects of the game. So, thinking of it just as a board game prospective, I'd also agree against the idea of breaking from that in any way, unless it were something in official Flying Frog cannon.

[alderdust]

I like the "When a hero makes a ranged attack all zombies on that L-shape that the hero is on move 1 space toward the hero that fired the gun."

[ForestRunner]

(01-04-2013 08:58 PM)StayPuft Wrote:  No, I said that, in my view, they CANNOT interpret a gunshot as a potential threat.

Oooops. My bad - facepalm!

I've gotta stop reading the Forums at work!

[LSD]

(11-17-2012 01:39 AM)ForestRunner Wrote:  Like the concept. I'll get our group to playtest the following tonight as an actual rule following the Walking Dead theme, rather than just simply a card or two. Naturally such a rule should apply to explosions from a logic perspective.

1) Alert Zombies: When a Hero makes a Ranged Attack roll 1d6. All Zombies on that board tile can move one space on a roll of 4+. (simulating whilst the zombie is aware of the sound, it may not be fully aware of the exact location/direction).

2) Attentive Zombies: When a Hero makes a Ranged Attack, all Zombies on that board tile can move one space. (bloodbath variant - always fun to mess with )

How many dots do you propose for these rulings